Re: WIN32 compilation, the spirit of GNU software.

[James Michael DuPont <mdupont777 yahoo com>]

I would like to call this little squabble to a close.
I promise to do my best to repair any damage that I might have caused,
emotionally and development wise. 

Here is a public apology : 

I apologise to the Hans, Cyrille,  and the whole dia development team
(again) for causeing them heartache. If I accused you directly or
indirectly of anything, my apology for that.

My questions about the GPL are in the grey area, and subject to debate.
Therefore I will do my best to avoid talking about them untill we get
some feedback from the FSF as I have previously stated.

Again, 
I will do my very best and put most of my free time this weekend and
the coming weeks into getting the dia compiling nativly for windows
using the mingw tool chain. Even better, under the debian cross
compiling environment.

In case my bad english, stupidness or troll like nature, or even
inflammetory style has prevented this from being communicated :

I have dropped the idea of the cygwin port,
Tor is using mingw32. The minimal port of the gcc to windows
that also has a debian packaged cross compiler. 

People have reported that the gimp build with mingwin32 is not that
hard, and i will be trying to reproduce that as part of the dia port.

I will be compling the whole thing from scratch, using all the good
work that you have done. 

I think that DIA is a good tool, and win32 a "GOOD THING" (tm),
so any damage I have caused, I promise to make up in work in making it
better.

PEACE and LOVE ! 

> Now, when JMD came at the beginning of this week, claiming that dia
> on Win32
> FTBFS and therefore violates the GPL, it was not because dia didn't

You have my apology. 
I did apologise already, and listened to your reasoning. 

I had dropped this issue, until I stumbled over the GPL FAQ.

Yesterday I saw that the GPL faw explictly says NO to the distribution
means that you have. Please forget any accusations that I have made
about the GPL, they seem to just be a matter of interpretation.

I am just asking questions. If it violates or not is a grey area. 
Please dont take my questions as accusations, I apologise for any hurt
feelings.

If I accused you of anything more, please tell me, you will get another
profuse public apology! 

> build on
> cygwin (which it still does not), but allegedly doesn't build with
> the very
> same tools Hans uses to build. The only problem that despite being
> told to
> do so, JMD repeatedly refused to install the sources for the
> dependent
> libraries. 

I am following the instructions and getting all the dependant libs
sources installed, from glib, gtk, ilibcon, gettext. 

These sources should be put on the same server as the binaries is what
I am saying according to the GPL FAQ.

> I would simply say that JMD lacks the technical and social
> skills
> to read a damn readme and understand that a depended upon library
> stands on
> itself and needs to be rebuilt by itself before the main application
> can be.
>  
> To summarise:
> 	- I believe dia on Win32 (regardless of native or cygwin/X) is a
> desirable thing
YES

> 	- We had such a thing, with the fastest arrangement (native Win32)
> until the beginning of this week.

Hans has decided to set a precedent and drop support,
I will pick up from there.

You are still distributing the binaries as part of the installer.

I have committed myself to build this thing, for win32 using native
mingw.

> 	- The native port work(s|ed). A Cygwin/X port is vapourware, and
> very likely to be less performant than the native port.
Yes.

> 	- The build system for the native build uses Microsoft NMAKE
> 	- There have been attempts at using mingw32 as a better native
> build system, a build system which would use autoconf/automake/GNU
> make/gcc
> 	- This particular work is not finished.
> 	- I believe it would be a very good thing if that particular work
> was finished.
I am going to put my work into it. For what it is worth, I promise to
do that ASAP. Given my free time schedule.

> 	- Regardless of the build system used, one must use dependent
> libraries compiled with the same compiler (be it MSVC, BCC or GCC)
> 	- There has been no deliberate attempt to prevent anyone from
> building from source on Win32. It just has not been done much outside
> of
> Hans' laptop. But it _can_ be done, and there is no deliberate
> attempt to
> retain anything (despite what JMD pretends to believe).

I have apologied for any allegations of missing files,
I am building from the sources that where described.

This last email flame was kicked off by my quoting of the GPL faq.

> 	- *I* can't and don't build on Win32, because my employer's
> computers don't exist for my personal gain, but for my employer's.


When the debian cross compile is running you will be able to do that.


> 	- anyone behaving in a cooperative, friendly and constructive way is
> welcome to compile, modify and contribute to dia on any platform.


I will do my best to be such a nice person.


> > Where does wine fit in here? Why would I need wine to either
> compile or
> > run Dia in Win32??? Why would I ever even attempt to compile or run
> wine
> > in a Win32 environment at all? I would hope I could just run Win32
> code
> > natively in a Win32 environment.
> 
> I believe Wine was quoted by JMD.

I said that I am installing the wine so that I can test the exe under
debian. The mingw32 gcc is cross compiling for windows.

Again, 
please let us make peace and continue with the development of dia.
If you feel that I have insulted or accussed you of something, please
tell me, I promise to apologise profusely.

I will do my very best to get the native mingw win32 port done as soon
as possible.

Mike

=====
James Michael DuPont
http://introspector.sourceforge.net/

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